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Nissan: electric vehicles need big taxpayer boost

CTV -- Nissan Motor is bravely -- or foolishly or naively -- arguing that taxpayers must subsidize the shift to all-electric cars.

Mark McDade, Nissan Canada's electric vehicle (EV) project manager, says that without government help on a range of fronts, the electric-battery car is not going to be accepted into the marketplace any time soon here in Canada, nor anywhere else in the world.

These might simply be interesting musings if Nissan were not so serious about selling electric cars, about making EVs a big business. But the fact is, Nissan CEO Carlos Ghosn is the first to say his company is making a very large industrial bet on EVs. Along with its alliance partner Renault of France, the two companies have spent some US$5 billion on EV and battery developing during the past decade.

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Submitted Oct 27, 2009 By: ilderton

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sosgas All-Star Author Portland Posts:526 Points:251,910 Joined:Feb 2009	Message Posted: Oct 28, 2009 3:13:45 AM Ignore sosgas Report Abuse TAXpayer's must pay everything ?????? NEVER !!! Whats Nissan"s developers doing ??
NedW Champion Author Indianapolis Posts:2,322 Points:505,515 Joined:Mar 2008	Message Posted: Oct 27, 2009 9:34:30 PM Ignore NedW Report Abuse NEVER! Enough bull s., already.
tomfromnm Champion Author New Mexico Posts:1,809 Points:546,090 Joined:Nov 2008	Message Posted: Oct 27, 2009 3:21:19 PM Ignore tomfromnm Report Abuse Only for american owned company
pgriff1 Champion Author New Orleans Posts:4,019 Points:1,227,250 Joined:May 2004	Message Posted: Oct 27, 2009 12:45:39 PM Ignore pgriff1 Report Abuse The government did it for Ethanol so why not electricity. How about a tax incentive if they are 100% American/Canadian made, including subassemblies.
car253 Champion Author Ohio Posts:1,996 Points:543,200 Joined:Oct 2008	Message Posted: Oct 27, 2009 11:51:16 AM Ignore car253 Report Abuse Increase domestic oil supply and let technology develop better and cheaper electric vehicles over time.
4warned Champion Author Michigan Posts:4,218 Points:1,252,960 Joined:Nov 2006	Message Posted: Oct 27, 2009 11:41:16 AM Ignore 4warned Report Abuse It seems like the government is suppose to be responsible for big business, what gives?
bobsalwaysmt Champion Author Long Island Posts:2,406 Points:154,905 Joined:Oct 2007	Message Posted: Oct 27, 2009 11:30:00 AM Ignore bobsalwaysmt Report Abuse Socialism at it's finest!
NorthglennBill Champion Author Denver Posts:3,008 Points:572,780 Joined:Oct 2008	Message Posted: Oct 27, 2009 11:20:27 AM Ignore NorthglennBill Report Abuse Everyone has there hands out for more taxes. Maybe we should just use what we have more wisely.
bongobro Champion Author St. Louis Posts:10,504 Points:1,650,665 Joined:Mar 2005	Message Posted: Oct 27, 2009 11:07:07 AM Ignore bongobro Report Abuse Nissan didn't need a big taxpayer boost to enter the North American market with its cars 50 years ago...why do they need one now? Funny how the taxpayer ends up footing the bill for something free-enterprise is supposed to absorb as part of its operating costs...
captngasTN Champion Author Tennessee Posts:1,730 Points:423,390 Joined:Jun 2009	Message Posted: Oct 27, 2009 11:06:05 AM Ignore captngasTN Report Abuse Taxpayers can't (and shouldn't) foot the bill for all things auto.
DickAAA Champion Author St. Louis Posts:1,350 Points:800,255 Joined:Jan 2005	Message Posted: Oct 27, 2009 11:04:11 AM Ignore DickAAA Report Abuse Toyota developed their hybid on their own money, why should the tax payers pay for Nissan's developement costs.
CruisinLinda Champion Author Tallahassee Posts:6,431 Points:1,290,210 Joined:Sep 2005	Message Posted: Oct 27, 2009 11:03:21 AM Ignore CruisinLinda Report Abuse High gas prices will throw drivers into the arms of EV manufacturers. Government can help by putting a surtax on gasoline for R & D of higher-capacity batteries.
doncNJ Champion Author New Jersey Posts:2,760 Points:561,920 Joined:Oct 2008	Message Posted: Oct 27, 2009 11:02:36 AM Ignore doncNJ Report Abuse Let the Japanese government subsidize this effort for their big three.
tazdriver Champion Author Huntsville Posts:4,892 Points:1,177,500 Joined:Jan 2007	Message Posted: Oct 27, 2009 11:02:11 AM Ignore tazdriver Report Abuse Greenie weenie tech always needs to plunder my wallet to survive, get rid of it so we can have an economic recovery.
lightbulbman2008 Champion Author Worcester Posts:43,245 Points:649,335 Joined:Oct 2008	Message Posted: Oct 27, 2009 11:00:37 AM Ignore lightbulbman2008 Report Abuse why do you need the taxpayer for everything?
regasaz Champion Author Phoenix Posts:1,145 Points:344,570 Joined:Dec 2006	Message Posted: Oct 27, 2009 10:57:43 AM Ignore regasaz Report Abuse New motto for auto industry - "When in doubt ask for a taxpayer bailout."
GoBlazers Champion Author Washington Posts:2,784 Points:397,710 Joined:Dec 2008	Message Posted: Oct 27, 2009 10:57:34 AM Ignore GoBlazers Report Abuse Good luck widdat, Nissan.
KarateDude Champion Author Cincinnati Posts:1,426 Points:304,845 Joined:Mar 2008	Message Posted: Oct 27, 2009 10:56:17 AM Ignore KarateDude Report Abuse Sounds like a cost of doing business to me.... Suck it up Nissan and their competitors...
TXGasPriceSpy Champion Author Fort Worth Posts:2,661 Points:499,545 Joined:Sep 2008	Message Posted: Oct 27, 2009 10:56:04 AM Ignore TXGasPriceSpy Report Abuse Why is it that everything these days must be supported by us taxpayers??? This is not good at all.
04tang Champion Author Ohio Posts:1,773 Points:385,955 Joined:Jul 2006	Message Posted: Oct 27, 2009 10:53:09 AM Ignore 04tang Report Abuse Taxpayers have subsidized enough. These auto companies will get there money back when ( and if ) they sell their cars. what about the taxpayers, when will we get our money back?
vizilo Champion Author British Columbia Posts:1,916 Points:1,831,620 Joined:May 2004	Message Posted: Oct 27, 2009 10:52:19 AM Ignore vizilo Report Abuse More government throw aways
52MPG Champion Author Dayton Posts:2,297 Points:766,135 Joined:Apr 2006	Message Posted: Oct 27, 2009 10:51:20 AM Ignore 52MPG Report Abuse Electric vehicles are the way to go. Batteries are not. Magnetic generators eliminate the need for batteries and allow unlimited milage. Asking for tax payer funding proves that the project is not finically viable.
yukonjack Champion Author Georgia Posts:4,384 Points:1,137,995 Joined:Oct 2004	Message Posted: Oct 27, 2009 10:48:59 AM Ignore yukonjack Report Abuse Why should I, as a taxpayer, foot the bill for a big car company's R&D? If the government wants to build the next generation of Obamacars, ... GAD! What a thought. UGH.
Doubleeez Champion Author Connecticut Posts:2,722 Points:542,265 Joined:Sep 2005	Message Posted: Oct 27, 2009 10:48:08 AM Ignore Doubleeez Report Abuse How many companies can a government subsidize?
hblee Champion Author Ontario Posts:1,796 Points:602,035 Joined:May 2004	Message Posted: Oct 27, 2009 10:47:44 AM Ignore hblee Report Abuse If their car is going to be that good, and as long as it's reasonably priced, then it should sell itself without any help from us taxpayers.
sgtbert Sophomore Author Allentown Posts:190 Points:108,325 Joined:May 2006	Message Posted: Oct 27, 2009 10:47:21 AM Ignore sgtbert Report Abuse If I didn't know better, I'd swear this is a joke. Whatever happened to the good old days, when companies made things and then asked us to pay to have them? Any risk they take that doesn't work out ends up a tax write-off for them. Not so for the taxpayer - we just get to keep paying and paying... And it's not like the cars would be cheaper for us because we paid to build them.
Chummy37 All-Star Author Calgary Posts:843 Points:452,860 Joined:Jan 2008	Message Posted: Oct 27, 2009 10:46:03 AM Ignore Chummy37 Report Abuse They don't need a big tax, just smaller batteries!
VTROCK Champion Author Detroit Posts:1,956 Points:420,830 Joined:Sep 2008	Message Posted: Oct 27, 2009 10:45:49 AM Ignore VTROCK Report Abuse No more Government subsidies. If the technology is viable for future products, then it makes sense for the car companies to develop it. If it's not, then don't waste taxpayer dollars trying to force a sqaure peg into a round hole.
hatterasjack All-Star Author West Virginia Posts:514 Points:324,230 Joined:Sep 2007	Message Posted: Oct 27, 2009 10:44:58 AM Ignore hatterasjack Report Abuse The point Nissan is making is that they are not 'economically viable' at the price they say they have to sell them. Mainstream buyers just cant afford them. So without some kind of subsidy their viability will be pushed way into the future.
Lizzylou Champion Author Stockton Posts:4,509 Points:1,498,905 Joined:Oct 2005	Message Posted: Oct 27, 2009 10:44:31 AM Ignore Lizzylou Report Abuse ANOTHER TAX??? I DON'T THINK SO!!
AC-302 Champion Author Los Angeles Posts:14,815 Points:1,941,735 Joined:Aug 2004	Message Posted: Oct 27, 2009 10:40:08 AM Ignore AC-302 Report Abuse Sorry? Why do electrics need a taxpayer boost? If it's economically viable, then won't the electric car simply stand on it's own merits (or fail on it's own faults)?
Art48 Champion Author Sacramento Posts:2,449 Points:80,900 Joined:Feb 2009	Message Posted: Oct 27, 2009 10:40:08 AM Ignore Art48 Report Abuse karmadrome - How much is you gasoline bill per month? If you didn't have to pay that do you think you could afford the little electricity it would take? Are you planning on totally discharging your batteries everyday? That's a lot of driving.
nojsts Champion Author St. Louis Posts:14,043 Points:2,828,980 Joined:May 2002	Message Posted: Oct 27, 2009 10:36:36 AM Ignore nojsts Report Abuse No more money for these companies. They take our money, they sell cars, male profits and do not have to pay back the money. I say the government could loan them some money to get started. just like we all have to borrow money when we buy a house or car.
BEngr Champion Author Illinois Posts:1,681 Points:608,160 Joined:May 2008	Message Posted: Oct 27, 2009 10:35:21 AM Ignore BEngr Report Abuse I couldn't believe that Nissan thinks that the taxpayers should subsidize this venture. That is the risk they take to develope a car at a low enough price that people will buy it.
sleepyt Champion Author Chicago Posts:1,378 Points:416,175 Joined:Mar 2008	Message Posted: Oct 27, 2009 10:34:59 AM Ignore sleepyt Report Abuse Can you blame these guys for trying to get government to do their job for them? After all, if they can fool taxpayers into subsidizing them, that's more profit for their shareholders. That is the goal of business. Our goal is to get energy costs under control, and to stop using as much fossil fuel. As we internalize that, there will be demand for EV's. But please, Nissan and Renault - don't insult us by asking for tax dollars to subsidize your investment activities. If the investment makes sense, make it. If not, wait for someone else to make it, and find the market, and then Nissan and Renault go the way of GM. Build vehicles that people want, and you stay profitable. See Honda for the example.
karmadrome Champion Author Wisconsin Posts:1,132 Points:362,045 Joined:Oct 2008	Message Posted: Oct 27, 2009 10:34:54 AM Ignore karmadrome Report Abuse Before we jump to EVs, we need good, sound domestic energy creation and distribution. I may sound like a parrot at this point, but I cannot imagine trying to afford my home energy bill, which is perpetually rising as it is, after it includes charging a couple vehicles.
Art48 Champion Author Sacramento Posts:2,449 Points:80,900 Joined:Feb 2009	Message Posted: Oct 27, 2009 10:33:09 AM Ignore Art48 Report Abuse No more money for cancer research!
SeerLV Champion Author Las Vegas Posts:3,473 Points:712,710 Joined:Jun 2008	Message Posted: Oct 27, 2009 10:32:45 AM Ignore SeerLV Report Abuse Just another company fishing for free government money.
THEDodgeman Champion Author Denver Posts:3,048 Points:967,465 Joined:Apr 2005	Message Posted: Oct 27, 2009 10:32:37 AM Ignore THEDodgeman Report Abuse GET RID OF THE BATTERIES...GO HYDROGEN
101Speedster Champion Author Ventura Posts:20,931 Points:1,831,390 Joined:May 2005	Message Posted: Oct 27, 2009 10:32:35 AM Ignore 101Speedster Report Abuse Electric cars will soon be the norm.
tmannd All-Star Author North Dakota Posts:682 Points:47,600 Joined:Feb 2009	Message Posted: Oct 27, 2009 10:31:40 AM Ignore tmannd Report Abuse no more bailouts,enough is enough
Art48 Champion Author Sacramento Posts:2,449 Points:80,900 Joined:Feb 2009	Message Posted: Oct 27, 2009 10:30:58 AM Ignore Art48 Report Abuse We'll need to increase the grid for the power it takes to make hydrogen, make more ethanol, open more Wal-Marts...
CISA Champion Author Orange County Posts:2,089 Points:673,320 Joined:Dec 2006	Message Posted: Oct 27, 2009 10:30:34 AM Ignore CISA Report Abuse Canadian aren't as foolish as the US gov't ---- are they???
Oldwolf Champion Author Raleigh Posts:1,766 Points:1,193,100 Joined:Dec 2004	Message Posted: Oct 27, 2009 10:27:58 AM Ignore Oldwolf Report Abuse TARP #2 coming up!
justinoles All-Star Author Orlando Posts:845 Points:175,830 Joined:Jul 2009	Message Posted: Oct 27, 2009 10:22:37 AM Ignore justinoles Report Abuse If you have sunk $5B into it already, and think it is so great then why involve us?
tomok Champion Author Portland Posts:18,269 Points:1,363,135 Joined:Aug 2006	Message Posted: Oct 27, 2009 10:21:10 AM Ignore tomok Report Abuse No more taxpayer money that the government does not have and the taxpayers will have to repay. If Nissan cannot build a long driving range EV, that has a fast recharging time and a low cost battery then don’t attempt to market the car. Will need more renewable energy from solar, wind, thermal, tidal, hydro, or nuclear for those EV’s. Need to support the national electrical grid in all regions of this country.
zornave Champion Author Louisville Posts:13,887 Points:2,204,540 Joined:Jul 2001	Message Posted: Oct 27, 2009 10:20:48 AM Ignore zornave Report Abuse Leave the taxpayers out of it. Taxed Enough Already.
Robert44 Champion Author Columbus Posts:2,835 Points:751,125 Joined:Mar 2004	Message Posted: Oct 27, 2009 10:18:58 AM Ignore Robert44 Report Abuse Nissan can go to Hell!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! They think we have one more taxpaper dollar to spend their idiots!!!!!!!!!!!
papou Champion Author Tampa Posts:5,658 Points:932,210 Joined:Jul 2005	Message Posted: Oct 27, 2009 10:18:54 AM Ignore papou Report Abuse Do we get to share in the profits -No profits No Money
antur Champion Author Chicago Posts:2,007 Points:495,845 Joined:Mar 2008	Message Posted: Oct 27, 2009 10:18:06 AM Ignore antur Report Abuse Taxpayers subsidize Obama and Co, they can not subsidize Nissan on top of it.